Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby brianm » Thu Mar 04, 2021 2:40 am

I'm sort of in the same boat. I had been planning to sell my '48 in the next year or so and start looking for the B-model of my dreams. At these prices I can't justify it.
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby GAHorn » Sun Mar 07, 2021 4:10 pm

KFS1998 wrote:The “Black one” on trade a plane is an A model with a STOL kit that was installed under the STC, which is incorrect as the STC is only for the B models as already explained on another forum.

Interestingly enough, that airplane ( with its previous tail number ) comes up on one of our forums on here prior to the STOL kit install. The “gossip” says that for years it had an incorrect airworthiness certificate showing it was a B model when the serial number clearly shows its an A model by production line.

I looked at it and when i saw this mistake, i immediately walked away.


This post is a “slight” diversion from the actual topic...but is offered as an “airplane-purchasing-hint”.... Tail numbers should not be relied upon as “fact” when researching airplanes. Tail numbers (registration numbers) change. They change for various reasons: Aircraft is destroyed or DE-registered and the number is re-assigned. Or,... the number is a “personalized” or “special” number having particular significance for a previous owner, so as the aircraft is sold ...or re-painted.... or the data- tag switched (illegally in most cases)... the registration number moves to a different airframe.

Research based upon the Registration or “N-number” can be very misleading.
Example: I once offered my 1962 A-55 Baron for sale and received a call from a potential purchaser in Seattle who expressed sincere interest.
We exchanged information to the point he was sending “Earnest Money” via over-night-express.

The next day he emailed me, “copying me in” on a letter he’d sent to his “attorney” threatening to “sue for misrepresentation and fraud” because he claimed I’d deliberately hidden the “fact” that my airplane had been horribly wrecked in an accident and must be a “data-tag-rebuild”. He was also notifying his FAA-FSDO office asking for investigation of my records.

Needless to say, I was “Pee-Oh’d” over such a drastic threat and so I entered the tail number into the NTSB database and found out that, sure enough, my N-number was totalled during an instrument approach crash. Reading thru the accident report it became evident that particular aircraft was a complete loss. You might imagine my astonishment at the idiocy of a threatened law-suit based upon that crash of that TWIN CESSNA 8O .... and sent a copy of the report...with the aircraft model HIGHLIGHTED... to the fool that threatened me. :evil:
(The registration number had been re-assigned to my Baron during a subsequent paint job as the owner at that time wished to retain the Baron’s original number.)

I hope his attorney submitted a full-invoice to him for services rendered.

I’ve told the story elsewhere in these forums where I researched the background of a Beech Travel-Air I was interested in buying... only to find that the subject airplane was a “data-tag/Registration-number-switcheroo” .... complete with decades of “no damage history” (falsified) logbooks. Another “save” based upon dumb-luck.

N-numbers are like Paint-Jobs: They are easily changed and can be used to hide facts.
Even serial numbers (construction numbers) can be misleading if a data-tag (data plate) is switched on airframes. These can usually be discovered only by detailed investigation and complete/detailed inspections. (I once assisted in a “pre-buy” inspection of a 170 for sale in central Texas that looked like an excellent example.... until I saw that the accessories on the engine and one of the avionics did not have serial numbers matching what was purported in the logbooks. Magnetos and starter serial-number data-plates did not match those recorded as installed in the logs. (All you guys DO record “serial OFF / Serial ON” when replacing accessories.... Right?)** :wink:
(And BTW, one method of proving the ENGINE installed.... IS the ACTUAL engine recorded in logbooks...is by comparing accessory records. If you one day discover your engines’ dataplate is missing... you will need to provide confirmatory evidence when requesting a replacement dataplate from the Mfr’r . It’s less-than-convincing when the alternator doesn’t match the generator that engine claims to have, either.) :wink:


** In a related matter, if you don’t have a LIST by SERIAL NUMBER of each of your accessories and Avionics and other installed-equipment... then you can be seriously disadvantaged if a theft should occur. Get those serials recorded, ASAP. Your “Equipment List” is a good place to record avionics serials.
Caveat emptor.
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby thejetjerk » Wed Mar 10, 2021 1:52 am

I am thankful I purchased my 170 last year or I could not afford to buy one today. I was concerned I was paying too much for my 1955 170 with an engine over TBO and no Adsb for 31K. Today I seen this on Barnstormers. Not sure if I am living in the passed or this is a typo or pipe dream.

1951 CESSNA 170A • $128,900 • FOR IMMEDIATE SALE • 1951 Cessna 170A for sale. TT 3088 hours, 15 SMOH. Fresh annual signed of 09/2020. TC IO-360D 210HP XP mod. 80" McCauley cs prop 15 SMOH. Veneer cables for prop/throttle/mixture. Cessna 180 Landing Gear legs with PPonk Modification. Cleveland wheels and brakes. KX 155 Nav/Com with glideslope, KX155 w/Nav. KX24 Audio Panel w/four place intercom. Door Stewarts, Rosen Sun Visors. Lift Reserve Indicator. ABI Tailwheel. Javelin Aug Fuel Tank. Bass seatbelts and inertia reel harness. Paint and glass 12/2018. Interior leather 2019. Fuel selector overhauled. uAvionix skybeacon wingtip ADSB. Make offer • deleted • Posted March 9, 2021
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby GAHorn » Wed Mar 10, 2021 10:22 am

thejetjerk wrote:. Not sure if I am living in the passed or this is a typo or pipe dream. ....


Both :lol:

The IO-360 Continental/Prop mod is a $50-$70K mod. (IF it was done properly.... and not one of the illegally-produced engine mounts, for example.) :wink:

...which brings up another point to consider: Just because a seller spends “X” amount of Dollars modifying or adding equipment to the airframe... does not automatically add “X” amount of value. It MAY... in rare instances, it may also add even more value than it cost that individual.... but it most-likely depreciates from the cost of that installation.
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby mmcmillan2 » Wed Mar 10, 2021 2:09 pm

That guy went full throttle on upgrades. 8O
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby GAHorn » Wed Mar 10, 2021 5:31 pm

Now he has to try to get his money out of it.
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby Hawkeyenfo » Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:00 am

What constitutes an “illegal” engine mount?
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby hilltop170 » Sun Apr 04, 2021 4:12 pm

No basis of approval, ie, non-PMA, no Field approval, no STC.
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby Hawkeyenfo » Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:28 pm

Thanks!
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby bgiesbrecht » Fri Apr 23, 2021 8:20 pm

I will say, I've owned my 170B for two years, bought for mid 40s and I've turned down a couple different local offers at the 60k mark going back to last summer to now.

'53B with ~480 smoh O-300A & some upgrades I've done since such as harnesses, pull handles, alternator/starter upgrade. Has 9/10 paint 7/10 interior.

I hate FB in general, but there are a couple listed on the FB 170 pages, asking 65-75k that are not as well-equipped/presentable as mine likely is. A lot of activity on the FB marketplace pages for aviation. I reach out and see if I can get a hint as to what they actually go for, and doesn't seem too far off asking. One of the sellers said he had over 100 tirekicker messages in a week, and several serious offers scheduling prebuys.

The demand appears to be there for now...
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby GAHorn » Sat Apr 24, 2021 1:50 am

It’s not just airplanes, IMO. There’s a lot of boomers who have had some good returns on investments, benefitting greatly during a strong economy and they also are at the ages where they have come into inheritances .... and with cash available, ... traditional valuations are no longer applicable.... Just today I looked at a piece of real estate in a junky “fish camp” neighborhood that ten years ago sold for $92K and last year on the tax roles for $115K and it was put on the market THIS MORNING at $199..... it sold today ..the SAME day as it listed...for $210 to the FIRST PERSON who called about it...offering TEN Thousand MORE than asking-price. While his offer was being made in the presence of my friend the realtor.... two people approached the owners and wanted to make cash offers..
This is not an isolated situation according to this experienced realtor.

That is what is going on in the markets these days.

I hope we’re not headed for another train-wreck like 2008/2009.
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby ghostflyer » Sat Apr 24, 2021 10:23 pm

We have the same situation in Australia, on property prices and quick sales plus the aviation market is very buoyant here also. I think George is correct [again] about the on coming financial crash. I am gearing up for it . I was thinking about buying another new aircraft [keeping the 170] and there is a 16 month wait list for delivery .
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Re: Cessna 170 selling prices (split topic)

Postby Bruce Fenstermacher » Sat Apr 24, 2021 10:32 pm

George, what you've seen in real estate where you are is also happening in my area. Houses don't actually make it on the market they are sold so fast and they are being sold for 20K over asking with all inspections wavered. We have a young mechanic who just moved back into the area. He's trying to buy a house. First thing that is different that what you saw is his price range is $400K and up. And he's not looking for a lavish estate. He's offered the $20K over list and no inspections only to lose out to a buyer offering the $420K in cash and no inspections and a quick closing. His realtor has actually suggested he might have to make an offer on a $400k house based on pictures and not even see the property or house in person. 8O
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