?Sticking Valve or Carb Ice?

[DaveF]

Drew, there is nothing like the satisfaction of using a (inexpensive) home made tool. So long as it works of course. That soft tube has worked for me and would be my first tool of choice, and I have the correct reamer.

Copper Reamer.jpg

Bruce,
Thought you'd like to know that your copper tube idea has gone international. A guy on another forum was stranded in Egypt (the real Egypt) with sticking valves. He had no proper reamer available so I suggested your idea. He said it worked well.

Dave

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

That's great Dave. Glad it helped. It does work well. And I kind of prefer it because it is pretty tuff to mess the guide up which can not be said of a reamer.

I can not take credit for the idea. It is one of those secret common sense lost techniques shown me by my airplane partner Leroy, who learned it on the farm in the late 40's and 50's keeping the equipment running. Any one at that time who owned a reamer probably wasn't a farmer. At least in his neck of the woods.

[blueldr]

George,
Why do you suppose that my use of mogas containing ethanol in my cars, my lawn mower, my Vespa scooter, my two small generators and my airplane, with two different engines and fuel systems, has NEVER given me a moment of trouble or any problems at all? You seem to have had a number of relatively serious problems with it and it's quite understandable that you would not want to have those kinds of things in your airplane. One of us must be doing something different from the other. All I have ever done is pour the stuff in and run it. Some of it is not even a little bit fresh. My generators get almost no use and generally about one test run a year. The fuel in my generator on my travel trailer up in Idaho must be at least three years old and it started on the first pull when checked last July.
Doesn't it strike you that we must be doing something different?

[GAHorn]

You must've waited so long the ethanol evaporated?

[170C]

Dick, it obviously has to be that RED Marvel Mystery Oil that you put in the fuel, oil, and drink a bit to boot that is making the difference. You just gotta get George to start using it

[T. C. Downey]

George,
Why do you suppose that my use of mogas containing ethanol in my cars, my lawn mower, my Vespa scooter, my two small generators and my airplane, with two different engines and fuel systems, has NEVER given me a moment of trouble or any problems at all? You seem to have had a number of relatively serious problems with it and it's quite understandable that you would not want to have those kinds of things in your airplane. One of us must be doing something different from the other. All I have ever done is pour the stuff in and run it. Some of it is not even a little bit fresh. My generators get almost no use and generally about one test run a year. The fuel in my generator on my travel trailer up in Idaho must be at least three years old and it started on the first pull when checked last July.
Doesn't it strike you that we must be doing something different?

Your lawn equipment, and other small engines do not have type certificates to comply with.

[GAHorn]

...
Your lawn equipment, and other small engines do not have type certificates to comply with.

Tom is correct of course, but the regional differences in mogas recipies might have something to do with it...I really don't know ...but I DO know THIS:

Mogas left in my lawnmower, garden tillers, emerg. generators, inboard motorboat, motorcycle, and two of my friends airplanes ...RUINED their fuel systems/carburetors to the tune of a lot of AMU's. I HATED having to take those carbs apart and/or replace them because it was EXPEN$IVE...and my Marvel Schebler in my tractor don't seem to care but the one in my airplane costs $2200 to rebuild and I don't need my airplane carb dying while my family is airborne.

I use avgas for off-season storage purposes in those other vehicles because of it, and have had no further problems, and I ain't rebuilding any of my friends carbs anymore.

[blueldr]

George,
You're going to have to face it. Some guys just don't know how to use mogas.

P.S. $2200 to rebuild a MS carburetor as is used in a C-145/O-300? Come on!

[bagarre]

A brand spanking new carburetor is pretty close to two grand these days

Since we're already off topic somewhat, does anyone have experience with Kelly Aerospace Carburetor overhaul quick kits told by AIrcraftSpruce for $500?

[n3833v]

I recently saw a bucket full of carbs from small engines replaced for corosion from our great regulation of ethanol. The owner of the shop told me he hired an extra to keep up with the demand. I use av gas in all my small engines also. No problem. Stihl also make gas for their engines.

John

[blueldr]

John Hess,
When you saw that bucket full of small engine carburetors wiped out by corrosion from ethanol laced gasoline, didn't it kind of make you wonder what they have done to automobile carburetors to preclude that ? I strongly suspect that there are more automobile carburetors than small engine ones and I don't recall hearing about too many problems with them.
Like I said, some people just don't seem able to use mogas.
Did you look closely at those coroded carburetors, or do you suppose that that guy had found a new gold mine?

[bagarre]

An automobile has an advantage with how much it's operated tho.
Fuel in my car will be replaced every 5 days (with as much as I drive).
Fuel in my lawn mower can last 6 months in the winter time.
Fuel in my plane can last two or three months depending how much I fly.

The longer the fuel sits, the longer the ethanol has to absorb water and other such things and thus corrode parts.

That's one idea at least.

[T. C. Downey]

John Hess,
When you saw that bucket full of small engine carburetors wiped out by corrosion from ethanol laced gasoline, didn't it kind of make you wonder what they have done to automobile carburetors to preclude that ? I strongly suspect that there are more automobile carburetors than small engine ones and I don't recall hearing about too many problems with them.
Like I said, some people just don't seem able to use mogas.
Did you look closely at those coroded carburetors, or do you suppose that that guy had found a new gold mine?

When was the last time a car was built with a carb? they are al FI now and have none of the problems with Alcohol that these old MA 3s do.

Alcohol has 20% less BTUs per pound than does white gas stock, that means you must use 20% more of it to make the same horse power, you can not do that with a MA3 style carb. the fixed size of the jets will not allow the variation in fuel flow that Injection does.

I could rant on and on, but won't.

[GAHorn]

Additional to whay Tom just pointed out.... bluEldr.... keep in mind that modern autos have PLASTIC and STAINLESS fuel lines and ethanol-resistant synthetic O-rings, hoses, etc.. Our 60 yr old airplanes still have fuel systems which CORRODE, and natural rubbber/nitrile/buna-N components that degrade in the presence of ethanol.

[T. C. Downey]

Additional to whay Tom just pointed out.... bluEldr.... keep in mind that modern autos have PLASTIC and STAINLESS fuel lines and ethanol-resistant synthetic O-rings, hoses, etc.. Our 60 yr old airplanes still have fuel systems which CORRODE, and natural rubbber/nitrile/buna-N components that degrade in the presence of ethanol.

The old MA3 carbs are mostly brass, or white pot metal. we don't see that much corrosion, I have 3, 0-200's with ma3s installed running wind machines in the orchards of eastern wa, they run on auto fuel with alcohol and e-85, they run fine, but they will only dyno 88 horse powers at full throttle.

altitude there is only 1000-1200 feet. and they only run the wind machines when frost is forecasted.