To primer or leave bare aluminum, that is the question

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

I think I may have asked this before but don't remember. But since Frank can get away with asking the same question 10 times before he actually acts on the advice, I feel pretty confident you will give me a pass.

The paint of our airplane us flaking off. I don't mean just a little. You can rub your hand over the fuselage and paint chips fall to the ground like dandruff. My partner Leroy and I have no plans to repaint this airplane. We simply just don't care. Paint does not make the airplane fly. So you could imagine what the answer would be when someone suggest we strip and polish the airplane. Strip maybe, polish, no way in hell.

But it has come time to remove the remaining paint on the fuselage because it really looks so bad as it is so the question is do we prime the bare aluminum with rattle can primer or do we just let the aluminum attain a natural patina. Keep in mind this airplane lives outside 24/7/365.

Actually the question really is would a plane protected with rattle can primer be better off than one with natural patina or maybe the rattle can primer will be more of a mistake to apply than letting a natural patina occur should at some point in the future another owner decides to paint.

Any paint experts on the forum?

[bagarre]

Rattle can will look terrible and will start flaking off after a season or two outside.

It will look bad because you just can't get an even spray over big surfaces with a can so it always has a tiger stripe look to it.
I painted a car flat black with spray cans. Looked OK at night, in the rain from 20 feet away. Anything else and it was terrible.

It will flake unless it's metal etching primer.. but a decent etching primer/sealer get's you into a paint job sized problem

Also, primers are designed to absorb moisture to a degree. That's how the paint layer bonds easily to primer. Primers are not sealers and are considered porous.


IMHO, bare aluminum will fare better in the weather than a cheap primer and will look much nicer once it's aged in.

Scuff off the remaining paint and clean everything up with some super fine scotch brite pads and soap. Tape off and rustoleum paint the original stripes in green if you want to get fancy. Then, wash it a few times a year with a rag and WD40.

From 50 feet away, it will look like it just rolled off the factory floor.

The originals weren't polished either.

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Rattle can will look terrible and will start flaking off after a season or two outside.

It will look bad because you just can't get an even spray over big surfaces with a can so it always has a tiger stripe look to it.
I painted a car flat black with spray cans. Looked OK at night, in the rain from 20 feet away. Anything else and it was terrible.

Dave, you did take a moment to look at our plane and it's paint at New Garden didn't you? It already looks bad. Tiger stripes, now that would be interesting.

It will flake unless it's metal etching primer.. but a decent etching primer/sealer get's you into a paint job sized problem
Also, primers are designed to absorb moisture to a degree. That's how the paint layer bonds easily to primer. Primers are not sealers and are considered porous

Yes i've heard this before. Not to worried about the flaking or even that it is porous. I just don't want to make an even bigger mess of it for the next guy.

IMHO, bare aluminum will fare better in the weather than a cheap primer and will look much nicer once it's aged in.

Scuff off the remaining paint and clean everything up with some super fine scotch brite pads and soap. Tape off and rustoleum paint the original stripes in green if you want to get fancy. Then, wash it a few times a year with a rag and WD40.

Well if I did use Rustoleum for original stripes they'd have to be, dare I say it, (I'm feeling sick some how ), RED

And you say WD40! Wash your plane with WD40!! Now where have I read that before.

From 50 feet away, it will look like it just rolled off the factory floor.
The originals weren't polished either.

What? The originals weren't polished like Steve Jacobsen's, Rusty's and Bruce Ryme's and Bill Kelsall's to name a few. We may have to resend some awards. Perhaps that's why George gave up polishing his to get closer to original and make up for all the other mods his has. He is the "original nut" you know.


Thanks Dave. That is one vote for going natural.

[bsdunek]

Correct, primer doesn't seal, and may be worse than bare aluminum. The originals weren't polished. How about cleaning up as bagarre said, and then put on some stripes with Duck tape? When it starts weathering off, you can do it in another color just for fun.

[GAHorn]

Natural aluminum is pretty easy to care for. Simply wash and wax...or wash with WD-40/water-mix instead of soap. (Soap is alkaline and not good for aluminum. WD-40 is anti-moisture and lubricates hinges, weatherstrips, etc., neutralizes acid-rain residue, providing an anti-corrosion barrier. It does not harm plexiglas. It smells nice.)

WARNING: Do NOT use WD-40 in an atomizer high-pressure-type spray gun to "fog" the interior thinking you are providing an anti-corrosion treatment. The "fog" will make a potentially-explosive mist and fogged-oil is instant pnuemonia.
If you spray it for internal corrosion, use a garden-type sprayer instead of a fogging-type.

[bagarre]

Correct, primer doesn't seal, and may be worse than bare aluminum. The originals weren't polished. How about cleaning up as bagarre said, and then put on some stripes with Duck tape? When it starts weathering off, you can do it in another color just for fun.

Hmm, I heard somewhere that they weren't polished when they left the factory but rather just good clean aluminum. (vs the near chrome polishing some folks have done). Dunno, I wasn't there.

Would be pretty easy to make those stripes out of vinyl decal material as well. (I hope that doesn't start another approval thread)

[170C]

Bruce, say it isn't so----------red stripes on your 170 Whatever happened to our champion Rat Plane guy And it wasn't 10 times Bruce, it was only 9

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

I like the duck tape stripe idea. Silver on aluminum like phantom stripes.

[GAHorn]

Would "duck" tape make it amphibious?

Or would it allow you to "duck" the approval-basis issues?

pirougue.JPG (10.2 KiB) Viewed 15191 times

Boudreaux and Thibideaux were neighbors, and one day Thibideaux saw Boudreaux loading his pirogue into the back of his pick'em'up truck and toss a roll of duck-tape into it, so Thibideaux goes and axes him "whut he gonna do wid' dat duck tape?" and Boudreaux say he "gonna ketch sum ducks" wid it....yew wanna go wid me?"


"NAW!! You cannae ketch duck wid duck-tape!," say Thibideaux... but later that afternoon, he see Boudreaux unload his pirogue from the back of his pick'em'up truck and it be FULL o' ducks!

Next day, he see Boudreaux load his pirogue into the back of his pick'em'up truck and toss a bunch of weeds into it,...so he goes over and axes him, "whut you gonna doe wid' does weeds?"
"Them ain't weeds," say Beadreaux, "Them be pussy-willows! Yew wanna go wid me?"
"YA! Jes' let me git me rubber-boots!" shout Thibideaux!

[N2255D]

I like the duck tape stripe idea. Silver on aluminum like phantom stripes.

No need to be boring Bruce . They have all kinds of colors like Cha Cha Cherry .

[blueldr]

One should be very cautious about residual adhesive as "Duck" tape ages. Some baked on old adhesive is dynamite to remove.

[170C]

Bruce, I'll bet that GREEN Rust-Oleum primer would go on FAST

[Bill Hart]

Bruce, I'll bet that GREEN Rust-Oleum primer would go on FAST

Yes, but would it come off just as fast???

[Metal Master]

Bruce,
My 170 has been in bare aluminum since before I bought it off of ebay in 2005. The aircraft had attained an aluminum oxide patina with overtones of fili-form corrosion in some areas particularly the curved fairings at the trailing edge of the wing that are riveted to the fuselage. Not wanting to paint the airplane due to cost. I started polishing with different things until i ended up with Perfect Polishes Nuvite the Cyclo polisher and Makita polishing machine with wool pads. [attachment=0]Ground Loop DSCF0013.JPG [attachment=1]Moose Creek cropped 2013 2.jpg
The airplane has currently not been polished for two years and has been in my partners care until early January. He has not washed or polished it. The surface has taken on a slight frosted appearance bordering on the beginning of fili-form corrosion not quite yet. My concern is that since the airplane was most likely polished post delivery from Cessna and numerous times over the years that the ALCAD surface of the aluminum has been polished away. This exposes the 2012 alloy which is more prone to corrosion than the protected ALCLAD aluminum, I do not know this for a fact But I suspicion it. My choice would be to paint the airplane in an ala F-15A Eagle sort of multiple gray primer sort of motif. But then even the two part epoxy primer-ed landing gear legs on My 170A are beginning to show signs of Oxidation. I would prefer to Paint the airplane but until the SSS show up in my bank account. the airplane will continue to get occasionally polished. I cant spray paint in the municipal hangers where i keep my airplane.
Regards,
Jim

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Thanks Jim. Our plane has never been polished but I believe lots of the alcad has probably been removed in prior paint processes. The wings and elevator had been repainted since the whole airplane was done and the paint different than what is going bad and peeling off the rest of the plane. So we will not be removing the good paint from the wings and elevators.

I'm leaning toward a bare aluminum fuselage. We can keep an eye on it and clean and maintain as necessary.