The International Cessna 170 Association

GAHorn wrote:The new Concorde RG25XC arrived and the included literature makes a statement I’ve never noticed previously…. They suggest replacement every 4 years. The logbook entries indicate that the last two RG25XC batteries each lasted 5 years in this ‘62 172-C.

I’m not ready for lithium…. at least not publicly.

(Lithium is used to treat and prevent episodes of mania (frenzied, abnormally excited mood) in people with bipolar disorder (manic-depressive disorder; a disease that causes episodes of depression, episodes of mania, and other abnormal moods). Lithium is in a class of medications called antimanic agents.)

My concord seems to be slowing down but it has lasted much longer than 30 years of gills

Sorry to bring back an older thread again as my first posting and as a relatively new 170B owner but this was the most recent and close to the subject of my question when I did a search.

Has anyone obtained a field approval for the SBS-J16 battery in a 170 recently? I am familiar with the Concord and Gill batteries. I have had them in one of my other aircraft and feel that the Odyssey is a better battery. I definitely would not buy another Gill. The one in this 170 is only a couple years old and already failed with a bad cell.

Thanks,
Dan

Dan, have a look at https://www.odysseybatteries.com/odyssey/sbsj16.html

johneeb wrote:Dan, have a look at https://www.odysseybatteries.com/odyssey/sbsj16.html

Thank you for the link. I have seen that but I am not sure I want to invest the $646 for a new battery box and STC. I would prefer to adapt to the existing battery box with a spacer as it appears some have done in the past.

Dan

Well i personally would not think about putting a Gill battery in an aircraft or lawn tractor . I used concord batteries for years but when they failed it was instantaneous and i was then stuck out in the woop woop. I hate swing starting an aircraft especially when you are by yourself. Then tried using odyssey batteries. They chew starters out. My engine “normally” starts on the first blade over. The odyssey batteries have great initial voltage but drop their bundle during the start cycle and during the compression cycles. Some of my friends on the airport who had Vans RV,s started talking about “Earth X ‘’ batteries. These tiny Earth X batteries were starting Lycoming Thunderbolt engines . These batteries are already STC,ed for cessna 182 aircraft and a mirade of other aircraft . These batteries only weigh about 6 lbs . Yes they are lithium batteries but each battery has a built in control system in them with a cockpit warning light. I have had EarthX fitted about 12 months now and never recharged it. It’s always around 14.3v. Recently I left the master on with rotating beacon for about 1.7 hours [not thinking and I was out in the woop woop. ] and was very worried would it turn over the engine over. No issues what so ever . Oh, EarthX are expensive to purchase.
PS. Woop woop means miles from anywhere . out back,australia.

The EarthX battery would actually be a little less expensive than the Atlee box, STC and battery. It would be something to consider depending on how difficult it would be to get approved. I would also like to see the actual life expectancy of the new battery technology.

Thanks,
Dan

I purchased an SBS-J-16 with the idea of gaining a Field Approval…. then when it arrived… I came to the conclusion that too many differences exist to quickly/easily adapt it to a standard battery-box and cables. The terminals simply don’t match-up as easily as one might imagine… they are not simply a “bolt-on and forget it” episode….. And the battery does not fit within the standard battery box. If you decide to proceed with an SBS-J-16 I would advise you to ascertain the “Return Policy” of the seller… because I think you may have to eat-it if the policy isn’t accommodating.

(To install it in a 170 you will have to use the Atlee Dodge STC : STC#SA02333AK-D manufactured by F. Altee Services

I simplified my battery problem….. I bought a replacement Concord.

One more thing: The Odyssey batteries strengths are physical/structural, good service life, and cranking capacity. While most of us only think of our batteries being necessary for cranking our engines… in actual fact…that is SECONDARY in importance for an aircraft. The PRIMARY PURPOSE of an aircraft battery is RESERVE CAPACITY for completion of a flight when the generated-electrical power of a generator/alternator/regulator fails In-Flight! The battery is supposed to get you somewhere safe to land while supporting your radios, lights, and other necessities…. Not for “cranking” the engine at the airport. (Cranking capacity after a period of inactivity is a good test your battery is healthy…as long as it completely re-charges prior to take-off…..but not a good test of capacity to meet emergencies.)

The Odyssey batteries…if you look at their Reserve Capacities…. are not good for that. The SBS-J-16 only has 15 CCA and even less Reserve. This is another reason I chose to stay with a genuine aircraft battery such as the Concorde. If you only fly day/vfr… an Oddyssey might work for you… but I occasionally run late and end up at night…and I sometimes operate IFR, so it’s not for me.

(Also, Odyssey only claims an expected lifetime of 4-5 years in average use…which is what I get from my Concordes as well…. hence my choice.)
If you’re not getting several years out of your ordinary battery…then something is missing in your storage, charging, or electrical-drains situation.

Thanks for the reply. I am familiar with the odyssey batteries and smaller hardware. I have an old PC680 (same as SBS-J16) sitting in my hangar. I use those type batteries in my experimental.

We need to make new battery cables with this battery replacement so adding the correct size battery lug would be relatively easy. That said I will probably just get a Concord for now to get flying and we will use the battery terminals to fit.

Dan L.

I spoke with the Concorde rep yesterday at the Alaska aviation trade show. My question to him was, if you leave the master switch on and run the battery completely down, how many times can you do that and get away with recharging the battery back to 100%? His answer was, depends. Depends on how long it is totally discharged. If you catch it the next day and use a correct charger, probably no sulfate damage to the plates. If you don't catch it right away, the longer it sits discharged, the more the plates will sulfate and at some point the battery will be unrecoverable.

His recommendation was to use the correct Battery Minder brand charger/maintainer every time you park the plane. AGM batteries have a good track record of lasting a long time even with no maintenance but if you always use a maintainer, you can expect maximum life. He also said it is recommended to leave the maintainer on the battery long term as it will continually desulfate and maintain the charge with no harmful effects. They are cheap insurance.

Concorde does not make Battery Minder brand chargers and gets no cut of their profits but Concorde does recommend using them. He said Battery Minder came to Concorde and got their charging specs, etc, and designed their Concorde-specific maintainers to condition Concorde batteries.

I personally use both Concorde and Odyssey AGM batteries and have had about equal service life out of both brands which is usually 6-8 years. I religiously have been using Battery Minders and replace the batteries at the first sign of loss of strength so I have never been caught out with a dead battery. The old ones go into my riding mowers and continue to work for several more years.