Flying from Alaska to America

[flyer170]

David..... We followed the highway all the way from Wi. to Alaska but got a little braver on the way back.
Notes from my diary: 7/19/90 Left Watson Lake for Fort Nelson. We left the highway and followed the beautiful Laird River valley to Fort Nelson. This is a remote area. We saw Hell's Gate rapids on the Laird river and bypassed Muncho Lake, Summit Lake and the highway which we had seen on the way up.

Landed Fort Nelson, enroute 2hrs 26 min. 310 miles
Fueled, checked the weather and filed direct to Fort St. John instead of following the highway.
We have good weather so we decided to change our flight plan, called Fort St. John and filed for Grand Praire.

Landed Grand Praire, 3 hours 15 min. 294 miles
Left Grand Praire for White Court
Landed White Court 1hr 30 min. 144 miles.
Total distance for the day 748 miles from Watson Lake.

This was VFR flying, PA 12, cruise about 100 mph
We filed VFR flight plans. We filed an ADCUS at Spring Bank, I don't know if the procedure is the same.
As for customs we needed all the usual personal ID stuff and aircraft papers ARROW and pilots license. We didn't have to show it all but you never know.
I believe that U.S.A. customs likes to have you purchase their customs sticker ahead of time. I guess I would call customs and check ahead of time, no sense getting held up because of paper work.
We were also asked where we had landed in Canada and at what times, so a good diary helps the memory.
Summit Lake was the highest pass we had to cross on the whole trip 4,200 ft.
We flew 9080 miles in 23 days. We flew 3,020 miles in Alaska
Avg ground speed 98 mph.
Some of our learnings: Good planning increases safety. Patience increases safety. Fill the fuel tank when ever possible.
Don't push the weather. Watch the wind forecasts. Mountains are hard. Listen to the veterns. Know your airplane. Alaska is beautiful, so is home. When in doubt don't go. Make sure there is fuel where you are going. Give bears lots of room. Do not fly to high. Do not fly to low.
Keep your head out of the cockpit. Know where you are all the time.

That wind I was telling you about in western Wi. is not the norm.
Bob

[David Laseter]

Bob,

That really helps us! My plane fly's at 100 mph (with the 80"prop, big tires, etc..). So we should compare pretty close to the PA 12.

Flying a straight path, I'm measuring:
Watson Lake to Ft Nelson = 240 s.miles.
Ft Nelson to Grand Prarie = 290
Grand Prarie to White Court = 144

We want to push on from Grand Prarie to Rocky Mtn House (60), Spring Bank (95), Lethbridge (120) for that day.
That would be Watson Lake to Lethbridge (805 miles for Day 2).

Day 3 - Lethbridge to Colorado, Springs. (915).

Thanks a lot for the notes. I've been printing all these messages out to take with us on the trip out.

Dave

[flyer170]

David... Good luck on the trip. Make sure your survival gear is complete, lots of remote country under your wheels. Pilot reports are valuable but sometimes we we the first ones through. Unexpected head winds along the route can be trouble if you don't have an out. The winds aloft forcast may give you an indication of turbulence in the mountains. We had set personal limits on the winds we were willing to fly in especially in the mountains. Take your time and lots of pictures. We camped at Watson Lake and White Court but it might be colder than you like.
The weather will probably be more unpredictable this time of the year.
There was a fellow who called himself the "Liard Trapper" who posted on this site but he hasn't been around lately, he would know more about the area around the Laird River.
Let us know how the trip went.
Bob

[David Laseter]

My goat hunting equipment is loaded and ready to go. We hunt goats in November in below 0 deg F weather. Sleeping bags rated to -40 F. My propane camp stove is also my engine preheater.

As two young newly weds, we drove this route in March. We camped all the way till Whitehorse. Temps were -30 F. That warm hotel room felt soooo good! We hope to stay in the same hotel, as we complete the return leg of this 17 yr adventure.
No camping! I'm sick n tired of being COLD!
We have plenty of Alaskan scenery pictures, we'll bring picture albumns to the 2003 convention.

Listening to you veterans has really steered me to cautiously taking the hwy.. A week ago we were going to leave through the St Elias Mtns, McCarthy (friend/gas), White River, to Burwash. Now it's Warm Hotel rooms, lot's of gas pumps, and if we get trapped by weather, welcome the opportunity on our 2nd honey moon!

Thanks again,
Dave

[flyer170]

Dave.... Goat meat, does that taste like horse meat, kind of sweet but good if you grill it over cow chips.
Racoon stew is good, better than possum.
My sister has a place down by Rogers Arkansaw anywhere near you?
I didn't mean to imply that I'm a vetern, lots of people on this site have more experience than I do.
Did you ever stay in the Roadhouse at Talkeetna
We landed the PA12 on the old airstrip and took a picture of it parked by Don Sheldon's old hangar.
If you have to detour and end up in Western WI. give me a call, you can stay here. 715-749-3339 Just kidding about the goat meat
Bob

[David Laseter]

Thanks for the hospitality!
Rogers is 80 NM to the North from Russellville.
I'll have to shake that Arkansas bunch up and get some fly-in's going.
We fly (wife & kids) to Talkeetna to get ice cream cones in the summer.
I've heard of Don Sheldon, but I don't know much about him other than he was - a famous Alaskan pilot?
I've just now gotten interested in the history of flying and 170's.
One of my good friend's Dad, Bud Helmrick, is known for his flying apparently.
I don't know what he did, except that he lived about 10 miles from where I'm working at this minute (2 degs F outside). I can see the homestead from on top of our gas plant. He guided up here (Slope) using his 170, I think! Jeff use to land the plane over here in our parking lot.
If it would make a big difference on this trip, I could get his new 7653 prop that's been sitting in the hangar for 3 yrs waiting to put on Bud's old plane which is being rebuilt.

Dave

[Roesbery]

Don't forget, Propane liquifies at -40F and you would need to warm the bottle to get gas out of it. Might want to include one of the gas fired stoves in your kit. I used to use a coleman catalitic heater in the cowling overnight, makes for a lot of frost on the inside of the windshield but the engine would start down to -35F. Steel becomes brittle in severe cold, I've seen pads on a D4 cat break off at temps below -40F. Landed in Fairbanks once at - 50F but didn't take off till it warmed up some.

[zero.one.victor]

Bud Helmericks wrote several books,at least one in conjunction with his wife,about flying in Alaska. I think the first one was Flight of the Arctic Tern,about flying a new Cessna 140 on floats to Alaska from Wichita. I have one on my bookshelf called The Last of The Bush Pilots. He had graduated to a 170B by then. I hear he later flew 180's.
I have another book called Wings of the North written by a guy named Dick Turner,about living and flying in the Liard River country of BC/NWT,Canada.
Both authors are worth reading.

Eric

[David Laseter]

Oh yes, both of those airplanes are at the Palmer Airport. Jeff's brother flies the 180. The Artic Tern isn't doing as well, but Jim Dutton in Fairbanks is rebuilding it completely, though.
I opened a book my roomate has in the room, Polar Pilot, to see if any of the names we were talking about were in there. I couldn't put it down. It was about Ben Eilsen pioneering the Fairbanks area. I had to make myself put it down because I'm trying to spend as much time as I can learning my GPS and also it was starting to make me nervous about our trip. He was pretty daring! Now I know where the name Eilsen Airforce Base came from.
I'm going to get those books that Jeff's Dad wrote. Guess I should get him to autograph them! Now that I'm leaving Alaska, I'm really getting interested in Alaskan aviation. And I'll get "Wings of the North", also.
By the way, Jeff is the smartest person I know. I'm going to get him to join the 170 Club and get on this website. He has at least 6 planes. From Commanche twin engines to a Fly Baby and 4 huge hangers on the Palmer Airfield. Now he also has the Fuel Service, Maintenance Shop, and the Local Flight School (Mustang Air) operates out of his Hangar/Office buildings. He wants to fix that Artic Tern up like orginal. Little tires/Pants/etc..
I showed a 175 owner all these messages that I've been downloading from this site. They took a 170 membership form and are going to join right away.
There is a 55 170B abandoned (for about 8 yrs) here. A military guy was leaving Alaska, had a little ground loop, and left it. It was totally repaired annualed, but he never came back. I think it has the orginal paint job. His name is Leon Mcinelly. The plane is N4464B serial 26808.

Dave

[David Laseter]

Rosebery,

Been caught in that situation. Cigarette Lighters don't work very well below 20' degs f.. Have to put them in your Sleeping Bag so they work.

-35 deg. is the shutdown temp here at work. We had a crane collapse at -40 one time. I was banging on gas pipeline we were putting together another time at -45. After I hooked it up and started pressuring to 1300 lbs, it blew like a missel. We found that I had shattered the steel joints when connecting them with the Sledge Hammer.

For preheating the engine I used a Whisper Lite, White Liqued Fuel, for years. Can be frustrating!
Had to get it started, then it would flame up under the fuel lines, had to keep the pressure pumped up and always worried about burning the plane up (that happened right there at Palmer). Finally one day it flamed up on my hands and burned the hair off my arm. So I went down to Walmarts, got a $30 one burner propane camp stove and Dryer duct. I couldn't believe how much better this works. Twist on one Propane Green Little Canister, Lite it (No Flame UP at all) stick it under the plane, crank it up, it will burn for 1 solid hour max output. When I get back from breakfast the oil temp gauge is off seat.
I put the propane bottles in my wifes sleeping bag, though.

3 Days to go,
Dave

[David Laseter]

Correction:
The 170 is being rebuilt.
I believe they still have the 140 (Artic Tern) also.

[David Laseter]

Flew all the way from Anchorage to Palmer, AK today.
LONNNNNNNNNG Story involving 337's and FAA.
But plane is waiting at the FSS and we are leaving at 06:00.
Winds are supposed to be 30kts tonight -50 in Anch.
Hope to make it to Whitehorse tomorrow afternooon.
-13 degs at Northway today - Fog there tommorrow.
Send back logs on the other end.
Goodnight,
Dave

[GAHorn]

Flew all the way from Anchorage to Palmer, AK today.
LONNNNNNNNNG Story involving 337's and FAA.
But plane is waiting at the FSS and we are leaving at 06:00.
Winds are supposed to be 30kts tonight -50 in Anch.
Hope to make it to Whitehorse tomorrow afternooon.
-13 degs at Northway today - Fog there tommorrow.
Send back logs on the other end.
Goodnight,
Dave

Give us a daily update and log of your flight legs? Tailwinds!

[flyer170]

Good luck Dave, God speed.

[Trapper]

Hi David,
Sounds like I'm getting in on this chat a little late. Once you leave Watson Lake you will be flying in my territory.
I would fly from Watson Lake directly to Liard Hot Springs.( Where the Alaska Hwy crosses the Liard River. If you have to you can land on Hwy and stay at Trapper Ray's lodge there. They also have auto fuel.
From there to Ft. Nelson it would depend on the ceilings. If they are high follow the Hwy past Muncho and Toad River. Again you could land on Hwy at Toad. They have a gravel strip but it may not be plowed. East of Toad you will have to go through Summit Lake pass.( the highest elevation on the entire Alaska Hwy) Once past there you will have clear sailing to Ft. Nelson.
If the ceilings are low I would recommend going east following the Liard River. Until you are past the mountains and then cut across directly to Ft. Nelson. Or you could follow the Liard until the Nelson river enters from the south, and follow the Nelson river to Ft. Nelson.
There is a forestry strip about 25 miles east of Liard Hot Springs on the north side of Liard river with a cabin there. Also I have a cabin with supplies and a snow mobile at the top of the Barricade mountains 15 miles north of The Canyon of the Drownd on the Liard River. ( no strip there, hope you don't arrive there) I also have a cabin at the mouth of the Grayling River where it enters the Liard.
There is also cabins at the mouth of the Scatter River and at Nelson Forks where the Nelson River enters the Liard.
I think I still have some pictures on the old site from the Scatter River strip taken in the summer. Look under Scatter River.
If you see a 170B with no paint, drop tips and airglass skis, that will be me.
I hope you have a great trip.
Trapper