The International Cessna^® 170 Association

Question to you FAR experts out there....I'm getting ready to repaint my '48 and I'm curious as to the size of the N number digits required. The regulation I could find seems to indicate that 12" numbers are required, yet I see gobs of older airplanes with 3" and 4" digits that have been recently repainted. Does anyone know of a regulation that allows this, or have I been misreading the FAR's? Additionally, if one does use smaller letters/numbers, does this affect flying into Canada?

Thanks.

-D

I don't know the chapter and verse, but there is an exception for older aircraft. I remember having to show my painter the regs in 1984 to get him to apply three-inch numbers to my 170. Not sure if it also applies to standard category aircraft or not, but experimentals can display three-inch numbers if they cruise under 200kt indicated.

I went to/through Canada in 2000 and 2006 with no problem. However, crossing an ADIZ (into Mexico or Bahamas for example) requires 12-inch numbers. A friend recently flew his RV-6 with 3-inch numbers to the Cayman Islands and applied temporary stick-on 12-inch numbers he had made at a sign shop. Others have simply used tape.

Miles

FAR 45.21 through FAR 45.29 covers what we need to know. Here is a link: http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/te ... .3&idno=14

AC45-2C is the AC which covers the subject. Here is a link:
http://www.airweb.faa.gov/Regulatory_an ... C45-2C.pdf

Beware! Crossing an ADIZ requires the numbers be on a VERTICAL surface! Painting them on your wings (a la originality) won't meet that rule.

Cessna originally painted them 14" tall on the wings...right upper and left lower surfaces. (Correction: 20" was original. Typing from the hip.... Memory failure.)

Aircraft built at least 30 years ago may be repainted using the original markings / number sizes.. this includes 2" numbers on the tail if you want. You are not required to go to 12" numbers on the fuselage.

gahorn wrote:Cessna originally painted them 14" tall on the wings...right upper and left lower surfaces.

Are you sure? When I repainted '82A I researched it and was told 20" military block. I had that confirmed by Russ Farris and by Chris out at Del Air who was working on a restoration (Steve Jacobson's maybe?) who found the original outlines of the 20" numbers when they stripped the wings.

Hi Doug, yes when I saw George's post I questioned that as well.

As you mentioned, my wing numbers are 20 inches, and so was my original 1946 Stinson 108. Russ Farris

In summary, for our antiques, the numbers can be as small as 2" on a vertical surface, or they must be 12", again on a vertical surface, if you're going outside the contiguous USA through an ADIZ.

robert.p.bowen wrote:In summary, for our antiques, the numbers can be as small as 2" on a vertical surface, or they must be 12", again on a vertical surface, if you're going outside the contiguous USA.

There is no AIDZ along the Canadian border, so the 12" numbers are not needed either coming or going. My understanding is that you only need them coming back into the U.S. from Mexico (or from anywhere else you have to cross an ADIZ). The ADIZ is shown on the charts. I met a guy returning from Mexico who goes there often. He carries stencils and dry erase markers and puts on the numbers just before he comes back across the border.

On my 55B the wing numbers are 20 inches top edge to bottom edge and 13 1/2 inches wide. Original paint.

OK - leaving myself open for chuckles I am compelled to ask this --

Several references have been made to Vertical surfaces so I ask this --

looking at almost any aircraft the only "vertical" surfaces I see are the vertical Stabilizer and the rudder unless the craft has winglets and these are also vertical or nearly so. All other surfaces are lateral (longitudnal) or horizontal.
What am I missing?

Joel

The side of the fuselage.

Apparently lots of variation has occured over the years.
An excellent article about this was published by Vintage Aircraft in their Dec. 2006 issue and is available online (which includes a "downloadable" template for anyone who needs to paint registration numbers on their airplane) is at: http://www.vintageaircraft.org/informat ... tters.html

(Stong Hint: Read the article if you are about to paint your airplane's registration numbers. Some examples of how troublesome errors can be are contained therein.)

The direct link to the template:
http://www.vintageaircraft.org/informat ... index.html

Mine are three inches tall and directly above the horizontal. The perfect place

Joe

I have what I call..."an honest paint job"...it don't matter on the N# size and location....everybody knows who you is....where you stays....it prevents unapproved "manures" and other stupid stunts.....and it is a real "chick magnent."

I just wanted to confirm what this discussion already indicated.... I had an old-age moment and mis-remembered the original sizes of registration numbers painted by Cessna on the wings back in the late '40's/early '50's. The numbers were indeed 20 inches. (And I had to go home and measure my own to realize my memory is simply no longer to be trusted. I edited my earlier error, just wanted to document it for future readers.)