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ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 4:51 pm
by Gman
If I buy some used avionics on ebay - what paperwork does the units have to have so I can legally put them in my airplane?
This whole 'yellow tag' is somewhat unclear.
Can I put an ex -Piper ammeter in a Cessna? Does it have to be a part that has at some time been in a Cessna?
Thanks.
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:13 pm
by Bruce Fenstermacher
Regardless of were a part comes from a person who is authorized determines if it is an airworthy and servicable part. Then in the case of a specific part like an amp meter an authorized individual determines if it is the approriate part. A Continental cluster gear would not be appropraite for a Lycoming for example even though it might be airworthy and servicable. A yellow tag goes a long way to identifing a part and it says that at least someone thinks the part is airworthy and servicable.
Yes it is entirely possible to put an amp meter with the name Piper painted on it into a Cessna. If the part is the part approved for that application or if the part is a standard part like an amp meter might be.
My advice is that if you don't know what would be an approved part for your application you probably don't need to be shopping for parts anywhere. At the very least you need to get advice from someone who does know who can tell you exactly what to buy and what not to.
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 6:23 pm
by Gman
What makes a person 'authorized' ? Does he have to be a Avionics Mechanic?
Am I qualified enough to buy a King KNS 80 and plug it into my Cessna and have a mechanic do the paperwork?
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 10:16 pm
by GAHorn
Buying used avionics can be a problem. They must be determined to be airworthy to be eligible for installation. Any avionics shop authorized to issue a Form 8110 can do that, as can the mfr'r. Example: When I bought my KLN-88 I returned it to Honeywell (Bendix-King) for a lithium battery replacement. That way, not only did I get a new 10-year memory battery, they had to issue an airworthiness tag (8110), which qualified it for installation.
(To be "authorized" the shop must not only be qualified to work on the unit, but must also have current repair manuals, in other words, they must have a subscription service to the repair manuals. I doubt many "mechanics" have that.)
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 3:03 pm
by Gman
Thanks
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 10:56 pm
by MontanaBird
Interesting question. I bought all the avionics for my 170B on EBay, during my panel upgrade. But, recognize that all items were yellow tagged, and my A&P inspected them again (visually) before putting them in the plane. And yes, it was all legal.
Montana Bird
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:50 am
by GAHorn
By the way... "yellow tagged" items of ANY type.... are only valid for the first installation since being tested. After they've been used, removed, and sold again... the previous approvals are no longer valid.... they are now "as removed".
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 4:12 am
by 4-Shipp
gahorn wrote:By the way... "yellow tagged" items of ANY type.... are only valid for the first installation since being tested. After they've been used, removed, and sold again... the previous approvals are no longer valid.... they are now "as removed".
George, were is this written? I am not disagreeing with you, just curious as to the source of this requirement for my own edification. Thanks.
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 4:42 am
by GAHorn
If an engine were "overhauled" or "remanufactured" and installed on an airplane and flown...then removed and sold to you.... would the previous 8110 still be accurate? How about an overhauled generator? What about an instrument that was calibrated, flown, then years later removed and sold to you?
And a radio?
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:59 pm
by mit
gahorn wrote:If an engine were "overhauled" or "remanufactured" and installed on an airplane and flown...then removed and sold to you.... would the previous 8110 still be accurate? How about an overhauled generator? What about an instrument that was calibrated, flown, then years later removed and sold to you?
And a radio?
Would it be ok to install and fly? What does the 8110 tell you? What does the log book on the eng tell you....
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:38 pm
by GAHorn
mit wrote:gahorn wrote:If an engine were "overhauled" or "remanufactured" and installed on an airplane and flown...then removed and sold to you.... would the previous 8110 still be accurate? How about an overhauled generator? What about an instrument that was calibrated, flown, then years later removed and sold to you?
And a radio?
Would it be ok to install and fly? What does the 8110 tell you? What does the log book on the eng tell you....
OK now, look.... I was leading into the situation with the radio via a segue from something a bit more familar. Of course the engine might be OK to install and fly. Why? Because it's an item that's easily inspected/tested and determined to be airworthy by most installers and most owners....after all , a logbook record, an oil screen inspection, a compression test and a run-up are all well accepted tests that meet the requirements.
But some items are not so easily tested. Instruments that require accuracy/calibration is an example. Most owners can slide an instrument into a panel...but do they have the data and abilities to determine airworthiness on instruments? Of course not.
Neither do most owners have the ability to determine that a VOR receiver is airworthy, or a transmitter is ON FREQUENCY without splatter, or that a transponder is on frequency without shadows, or an antenna isn't leaking RF or providing escessive SWR's to damage the transmitter, etc etc. THATS what a 8110 tells you. The unit is airworthy and eligible for installation. (And it's required in order to meet the intent of the FARs.)
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:19 pm
by webmaster
gahorn wrote:
...I was leading into the situation with the radio via a segue from something a bit more familar...
For those like me that didn't know what "segue" means, this from dictionary.com ...
Code: Select all
–verb (used without object)
1. to continue at once with the next musical section or composition (often used as a musical direction).
2. to perform in the manner of the preceding section (used as a musical direction).
3. to make a transition from one thing to another smoothly and without interruption: The conversation segued from travel anecdotes to food.
–noun
4. an uninterrupted transition made between one musical section or composition and another.
5. any smooth, uninterrupted transition from one thing to another.
There is a lot of segueing in these Forums!
Thanks, George, for the new addition to my vocabulary!
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 2:37 am
by GAHorn
It's not a segue when you simply steal the topic Dale!
(BTW... it's pronounced Segg-Way).... as in "What does an egg weigh?"
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 11:43 am
by 170C
Segg-way? Now George, I thought that was one of those 2 wheeled, battery powered devices you could ride around on
See you next weekend
Re: ebay Avionics legal ?
Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 9:09 pm
by blueldr
Life is a lot easier for a "Bootlegger" like me. I don't worry about yellow tags, etc. That's one of the advantages of being old, dumb, and partially color blind. If I worried about all that legality stuff on what I consider minor items, I'd probably be even older.
How often have guys bought a replacement starter, for example, from a "Junk Yard", installed and, if it worked, entered it in the log book and flown it.
The entry in the log book probably says "Installed like serviceable item". It cranked the engine, so it was serviceable.