Tying the bird outside.

[bagarre]

I'm about to buy my first plane; a '52 170B and I CAN'T WAIT!!
The plane is in beautiful condition with 4 year old paint and no appreciable corrosion anywhere.
I'm real excited but there is one issue.

There is no way I can afford a hanger in the Washington DC area so, I have to tie her outside.

So, I'm looking for advice on what I can do to minimize the affects of weather.
She will be flown often, I plan on a cover for the windows and promise to wax her at least twice a year.

Past that, what else is good practice for a plane being left in the weather?

Thanks in advance.

Oh yeah, does anyone have an L-19 tailwheel bolt or a right glove box door they aren't using?

Cheers,
-David

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Congratulations David.

First I would consider a windshield cover that goes inside the windshield. Covers on the outside tend to rub paint off. In leu of that I would consider a cover that snaps in place. You probably will have to have one custom made. My first 170 has such a cover and the paint did show any wear.

Keeping a plane outside and keeping it looking nice is VERY doable. We have a couple of members in north central NJ, Bob Olsen and DAve Germaine, both long long time owners who keep their planes outside. Yet they both look like hangered airplanes when they fly-in.

You don't need a L-199 eye bolt to tie down of course, just tie the rope around the tail spring but you can (and I'd recommend) you order a new one from Air Repair http://www.airrepairinc.com/ and tell them George Horn sent you and that your a TIC170A member. This referral is important because you may get a discount (I don't remember) and George hits them up to support our association auction which they have in the past.

Glove box doors can be found but they aren't every where. My partner has a spare that I've pictured but he won't part with it. One could be fabricated easily sans the depression around the knob until you find one. I could help you with that using the one I have as the sample. Do you have the hinge parts that are located inside the instrument panel? Do you have the glove box itself? I can probably help you out there as well with at least measurements for fabricating the box.

[SteveF]

Congratulations David on your new 170 – it's a great all around plane and you will have a lot of fun with it.

Also welcome to the association. You will find a fantastic amount of great information and maintenance tips by reading through these forums.

The 52 170B I have has been tied outside sense 1971 and has survived well. It will weather faster than in a hanger but the savings in cost will more than cover most of the extra weathering.

I agree on inside window reflectors to keep the sun from getting to the interior and NuFinish, orange bottle, as wax on the plane. If nothing else put the wax on the top of wings, top of cowling, horizontal tail surfaces, and top of fuselage in November as it keeps the snow from sticking to those surfaces. As soon as possible after a snow storm get to the airport and use a snow brush, soft plastic plate on a shaft, to get the snow load off the plane. The wax makes the brush work and the brush does not scrape the paint.

I am not a fan of windshield covers as a flying club at another field that got a lot of wind had one and it ruined the windshield in a short time because sand kept getting under it and then it would be rubbed into the windshield by the cover.

Finally look at the forum discussions on what is the correct rope to use and make sure the anchors in the ground are not about to rot away.

Good luck with the new plane !!!!!!!!!!!

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Steve brings up a good point. In the north east as you have found most hangers start at the low end of $350 a month and go easily to $500 a month. At these rates you could repaint your airplane about every 4 years with the savings tying down outside.

Oh and don't feel alone not having a hanger, I don't either and never likely will for the exact same reasons, cost.

[N2625U]

My so-called hangar is just a roof on poles. Costs about $120/month so it keeps the snow off of it. Since I do fly in winter and work on my plane it is nice to have a roof when it rains and I want to work. AND I HAVE ELECTRICITY!!! I'll plug it in the day ahead with a blanket over the cowl and it is toasty warm the next day when i want to go and I have a trickle charger on the battery. To me that is worth it in New England winters.

To my Texas buddy I had to explain what preheat is.....

[bagarre]

All great advice!
I was worried about the external covers as well because of chafe.
Making internal panels is actually pretty easy.
Should I worry about the windscreen and side glass deteriorating?

Regarding the glove box; I don'd have any of the parts for it. Currently, the transponder is over there but I want the transponder on the left with the radio. It's awkward to reach all the way over to change codes...and in the SFRA, you change them all the time.

So, maybe this could start a good thread; Glove Box construction.

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

The 170 I own has lived it's entire life outside. I think it's on it's second windshield and we're not thinking of replacing it. So I suppose UV probably effects plexi but it's pretty slow.

What airport are you going to base your plane?

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

BTW you can buy that aluminum foil covered bubble rap, the stuff car sun deflectors are made of, at Lowes. 2" and 4" widths and different lengths.

http://www.lowes.com/pd_13358-56291-BP4 ... Dreflectix

A 4" x 25 foot role for $40 is enough to do your entire airplane and a few car windshields.

[flyguy]

I'm looking for advice on what I can do to minimize the affects of weather. She will be flown often, I plan on a cover for the windows and promise to wax her at least twice a year. - - - good practice for a plane being left in the weather? -David

This outfit makes good quality stuff. The wing and horizontal stabilizer covers do a good job of keeping the elements at bay. Sun is hard on the paint but ice and snow are nearly as bad. These covers are light and if there is a layer of snow or thin ice it will come right off with the covers. And you can fold them up and take them with you if you are going on a trip where there may be snow or ice.

http://www.kennoncovers.com/wingcovers.htm

[GAHorn]

David, one thing you should think about is finding a method to keep water/rain out/away from your fuel caps, and from running down your doorposts and rotting your carpet.

The fuel caps sit on top of the filler-tube...which comes up from a "moat" which holds water. Although the machine screws which fasten the filler-tube to the tanktop should have been sealed with pro-seal/etc.., there's a strong likelihood that water will find it's way down into your fuel tanks. A large, waterproof, rubber-mat coving your caps would likely work, just keep in mind that you'll want to prevent the wind from blowing it off. One method that a Member uses is some custom-made waterresistant slip-covers (similar to wing-covers) about a foot wide, that wrap completely across the top of his wing from leading edge to trailing edge and connect via straps on the underside of the wing.

As for the water entering at the wing roots/windshield and running down doorposts to saturate your carpet: Remove the wing root fairing and use high-quality duct-tape or rubberized tape to seal the gap at the wing-root-to-cabin, and to completely wrap/cover the area between the windshield and wingroot. (This latter action will also stop air-leaks in flight and help control/improve cabin heat in winter.) The tape is hidden by the wing root fairing when it's re-fastened.

(Dubya.... (and 172 taildraggers) your 206 can do even BETTER! because your fairing will come completely off the TOP of the wing as well. You have the opportunity to completely seal that wing root.)

[n3833v]

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Here are my covers after a bad rain storm. They are outside sign material.
John

[GAHorn]

Duane Shockey had a set made similar to other cabin-covers, out of water resistant fabric, perhaps by a specialist such as Bruce's Custom Covers (although I think he used a difference source, actually.) They are very well tailored and fit nicely. The advantage besides covering the gas caps from rainwater is that they also prevent the early flaps from fluttering in the breeze. (Ragwing and-A-model airplane's flaps do not "lock" in the retracted position. Strong winds, prop-blast/helicopter-blast can damage the flaps unless they are restrained. Many such owners lock their flaps in the DOWN position to avoid this. Duane's solution does double-duty by protecting the flaps AND gas caps.
Somewhere I know we have pic of his arrangement, but I cannot find it just now. They are similar color to his paint job, and when installed, appear to be painted-on British Racing Stripes (although since his airplane is not red, they are obviously not for racing.)

[n2582d]

If cheap, light, and strong are the criteria for these covers, one might consider making them out of Tyvek. Not sure how Tyvek holds up to UV though. Maybe a house builder reading this could answer that.

[counsellj]

David

I have a brand new L-19 bolt, still in the bag that I bought from airrepair about 7 months ago. I decided not to use it on my bird. I will sell it to you for $20 bucks and $3 for shipping. I also have a glove box from my 55' B - Model. I don't know if it would work for you, but it is a possibility.

Jon

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

It would appear from the different part numbers and the illustrations in the IPC that the early glove box '52 and prior is not the same as '53 and later.