Reason 127 why Franklin engine conversions are a bad idea

[marathonrunner]

This is what it takes to change a starter. Oh yes Sky tec no longer supports their starters so you get to buy one of the NOS ones at Franklin Aircraft Parts in Texas. The Sky Tec will barely fit in after you send it to Sky Tec to spin it to get the bendix out as far as it will go to be wormed in and clear the gear. The NOS is to long to accomplish this without disconnecting things that will stretch...throttle cable, tach cable, prop cable, associated wiring , breather and vacuum hoses.

Takes about 7- 8 hours start to finish. Now is a good time to do your magneto 500 hour inspection

[bagarre]

That's some interesting firewall bracing. Was that part of the conversion?

[marathonrunner]

For the Franklin it was. He has all the paperwork for that conversion. Amazingly he bought it with the Franklin installed. The previous owner REMOVED an Avcon 180 HP conversion to install the Franklin. Not sure when the 360 Continental became available.

Had to persuade one mount hole to line up on installation. Come alongs are great tools on occasion

[170C]

Reason 128 (if not already mentioned) is that Franklin's use 14 mm spark plugs and according to my friend with a Stinson 108, those can be somewhat difficult to find and are more expensive than the larger ones used in Continental & Lycoming's.

[ghostflyer]

What was he smoken, to take a 180HP out and fit a Franklin? Must have been a bad batch of wacky weed to do that. I know people say that the 180HP lycoming vibrates But!! how many Cessna,s , Pipers and other aircraft manufactures fit that engine to their airframe? Plus having the engine and prop dynamically balanced helps big time . plus its not a huge cost.

[marathonrunner]

Actually the 14 mm depends on whether you have the original Franklin or the PZL version. This is the latter and has 18mm plugs. I do have a nearly full box of Champion 14 mm plug gaskets. They also did away with the floating oil pick up. Always did wonder why people put filters on the old style since the oil is picked up from the top. Drain it through a tee shirt and see what you get.

[blueldr]

Maybe the reason to have converted from the Lycoming to the Franklin was to get the forty more horsepower. It does make an awesome performer.

[marathonrunner]

The continental makes more sense

[GAHorn]

What was he smoken, to take a 180HP out and fit a Franklin? Must have been a bad batch of wacky weed to do that. I know people say that the 180HP lycoming vibrates But!! how many Cessna,s , Pipers and other aircraft manufactures fit that engine to their airframe? Plus having the engine and prop dynamically balanced helps big time . plus its not a huge cost.

Those later Cessnas, etc. also have very different engine mounts with large, SOFT rubber Lord mounts to help absorb those four cylinders banging away trying to make 180 hp.
Yep, he was smokin' something bad...to miss out on a Continental 6-cylinder IO-360 making 210 HP.

[DaveF]

Well, as they say, laugh if you want; keep up if you can.

My son and I flew up to Leadville on Saturday. Those four cylinders banged away, somehow getting the two of us and full fuel off the runway at 7000 DA, then hauling us upward at 400fpm to 14500'. Oh, the banging was terrible! Why, even the Blackhawk pilot on the ramp at Leadville came over to ask if everything was ok. Then, thanks to that infernal banging, the takeoff at 11700' DA took a whole 1000 feet of runway! I tell you, the banging sucked all the enjoyment right out of the flight!

[GAHorn]

How many hours do you have on the Lyc? and what does that fiberglass nose cowl look like up close?

Of the several I've inspected after a few hundred starts, the cowl looks horrible due to all the shakin' goin' on, and the windshields also don't last long without cracking. (But the takeoff/climb performance is truly wonderful.)

[DaveF]

My Avcon is one of the oldest, done in 1973 and 2300 hours ago. The windshield is fine (20 years), but the nose is pretty bad. The fiberglass itself is ok, but the Bondo the installer used is cracked and nasty. I hate it, and am planning a nose bowl renovation at some point, including replacing the fiberglass cowl bumps with aluminum, like Del-Air uses. I've owned three airplanes made in the 1970s and have a strong hatred of any parts made of plastic or fiberglass. They just don't hold up.

[GAHorn]

Do you have a "one piece" (floating) windshield?

[DaveF]

Yes, strapless floating "one-piece".

[dunlaps3]

Well it looks like "Reason 127" does not apply to me. I have taken off my starter and mags without any trouble. Maybe your engine mount was built too short.
And I don't know what the other " 126 reasons " are , but for me , both my 170B's with 220 HP Franklins have been Great Engines. I have had "Zero" problems with them in the 15+ years that I have had them. I can't say that about my $45,000 Factory built Lycoming IO-540 that has let me down twice in 200 hrs since new ! and BTW , the spark plugs in my 6A-350-C1 s are standard 18MM , not 14mm. Andrew