Flying with a Mac map

[tarsen]

Do any of you guys fly with a Mac with moving maps in the cockpit (not ipad). I have a new macbook and would like to find some moving map software to use with my Garmin GPS III.
What would you recommend as the best software to work with Garmin?

Thanks for any help
Tom Arsenault

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Hi Tom.

I am a looong time Mac user and a MacBook Pro as well as a Garmin GPS III owner. The very first problem you will have is interfacing the GPS III as it uses the RS232/422 interface no longer found on computers. You will have to buy a serial to USB converter and HOPE it works. (they all don't work 100% I've been told)

You would be much better off in my opinion buying a GPS unit to work with your Mac. One GPS unit which I bought is the DUEL XGPS 150 http://xgps150.dualav.com/

These are available for under $100 many places and are becoming VERY popular. This particular unit (unlike many) will work with your computer AS WELL as an IPAD should you get one of those later.

Once you have a GPS working with your MAC with isn't hard really, the next trick will be software. And this will be the big trick. There is no software for the specific purpose of air navigating that I'm aware. It is all being written for the IPAD because that it the market. APPS won't run on your MAC (or a PC). You could probably use other car navigation software such as DeLorme but their products aren't tailored for air navigation specifically. You would also then have to acquire geo referenced sectionals, either buying them or scanning a paper map. And then you'd have to keep it updated.

Lots and lots of work for very little benefit. Simply easier to break down and buy an IPAD.

[tarsen]

Bruce
Thanks for the info. I have considered a Ipad but needed a portable computer first. I know they have great mapping software for them. I have some neat maps from Sky Vector but do not know of any way to use them with a GPS. Maybe all I am doing is playing with the technology.

Tom Arsenault

[Flyfshr]

I used to have a GPS III that I downloaded maps to from a Macbook pro.

I bought the usb to RS232 adapter that Bruce mentioned and had a copy of Parallels that ran Windows XP. The map software was the Garmin version that came with the unit. It worked pretty well until I sprung for the new Aera that uses a USB interface.

-Tim

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Tom it sounds like you have one of the required elements. That is geo referenced maps from Skyvector.

Adding a GPS that communicates to your computer and software for the geo referenced maps are the missing pieces for at least some use of your MacBook as a nav aid.

The DUEL XGPS 150 is a no brainer because it will work with both your computer and any future IPad and at under $100 is pretty cheap.

Skyvector might have software or a clue as to what software might work the best. I'll look at their site and see.

BTW I've not used by MacBook Pro to actually navigate but with the DUEL XGPS 150 and a piece of free street software to check on our progress on a flight in a big silver tube to Las Vegas and it worked fine.

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

What you are talking about Tim is different than what Tom is looking to do. I'm glad to hear a 232 to USB adapter worked to communicate to the GPS III. I've resisted buying one. Tom doesn't want to upgrade the map in his GPS III which you never could do with geo referenced maps to a GPS III (and map/nav data for the GPS III is no longer available). Tom wants to use the GPS III as a GPS with his MacBook.

Garmin has some software that might allow geo referenced charts and there is another great piece of software ExpertGPS that I own and recommend that will. But these have to run in the Windows environment. Not a big deal for a savy Mac user because a Mac can run both environments assuming you already own a copy of Windows.

You can set up your Mac using BootCamp which is free with the Mac. As it comes you can run the Mac environment OR Windows but not both. Parallels allows you to run both at the same time but costs a few bucks. I'm using Oracle Virtual Box which is free. It allows you to run Mac and and five other operating systems at the same time. Very cool but maybe a bit more complicated to set up.

[Flyfshr]

You're right, I misread the original post. But the cable worked great though.

I'll have to check out Virtual Box. That could come in handy.

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Virtual Box is FREE. I had a bit of trouble with the first download as something just wouldn't load right. Tried another download and all worked. It takes a bit of fooling with the settingx and getting use to it but once set up is very slick. It's a computer in a window basically.

[tarsen]

Guys
Here is where I am on this. I have switched to using my Etrex Ledgend because it has a USB interface so it is easier to start with. I have it connecting to google earth and can get waypoints from it. I have yet to see any movement of the display when I move the Mac ( I have not tried it in my car yet)
I have a copy of Vmware Fusion that I got with the machine but have not yet installed it. I have some concern about opening the computer to viruses when start a windows version. I am still trying to learn all about the Mac to see if I can move to it for all my work. So far so good. I am going to reread the posts and see what I should try next. Any ideas about Fusion?

Thanks for all the info and keep commenting.

Tom A.

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Tom,

The problem with Google Earth (and a lot of other maps) is you have to have internet access to use it. You need software that at the least caches the maps. I fooled around with Expert GPS a little bit. I downloaded the New York Section for free from the government sight. I georeferenced the sectional and can view it.

Expert GPS is a Windows program so like I said I am running it under Oracle's FREE Virtual Box. I'm not worried about viruses using it because I don't go to sites or download questionable stuff in Windows. (I don't try to do it in Mac OS either) and if I go get a virus I'll just dump and reload the VM.

The only GPS I have that is USB is my Nuvi 760. I was not able to get that into a track mode and am not sure it is capable of doing it. I do have a question into support about it. If the software can't track the GPS it can't place you on a map.

My DUAT XGPS150 connects through the Mac Bluetooth. I've not been able to get it to connect through into the Windows environment to a Com Port required by Expert GPS. The Windows XP I'm running in the VM doesn't support Bluetooth (or I can't find it) so I haven't been able to try that route.

So I finally got around to buying a serial to USB converter so I could hook my Garmin GPS Pilot III to my computer. Last night I got it to work through the VM and Windows XP and Expert GPS. But I was not moving so I couldn't fully test or understand if it would really track across the NY sectional.

[GAHorn]

I never realized we had so many indepthtechnogeeks. I thought Ol'Gar was our onlyest.

Bruce, you need to add your Nuvi 760 and GPS/bluetooth to your signature.

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

Just a quick update.

I was able to test the following set up in my car. MacBookPro running Oracle Virtual Box with Windows XP running on a Virtual Machine. In Windows XP I had Expert GPS running with a geo referenced NY sectional. I used my Garmin Pilot III set on NEMA 4800 baud connected to a serial to USB converter from Staples which with it's drivers creates a COM3 port.

It worked but I've got to study the geo referencing technique as it was a bit off most likely because I have a setting for the type of map incorrect. When I switched to Open Source Street Maps which Expert GPS has as an option, the tracking was very accurate, specially considering the Garmin Pilot III is not a WAAS receiver.

Is this set up practical? Not for me to consider using today in the airplane except maybe for a demonstration. It would have been a hot set up 8 years ago but with larger screen GPS like the Aera series or the IPad, which it more closely resembles, it is awkward.

It could be made better and maybe even palatable with the following. First I have a MacBook Pro "15 which is a very nice computer for most other projects but a bit big for the cockpit. A cheaper smaller MacBook would work better though the glossy screen found on these models might be a problem with glare. If we could find Mac native software equivalent to Expert GPS that would eliminate the virtual machine layer or software which just adds complexity to the system. A newer GPS which connects directly to USB would eliminate the adapter and software but that would only be a minor improvement. Being able to use my bluetooth Dual XGPS150 would be great. It would eliminate all the wires plus it's a WAAS receiver half the size of a computer mouse that can easily be carried in the computer bag.

[Flyfshr]

My brother had a tablet PC set up with an external GPS and XM weather. Like you said Bruce, it was a nice setup about 7 years ago. Today it's just clunky.

I see you're choosing to "rise above" George's insinuations that folks with an affinity for terms like VM ware and COM3 ports should be grouped with folks that may have difficulty getting a date on Friday nights.

Yet here I am posting to a forum on a Friday afternoon. But I'm married, so that doesn't count....

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

My brother had a tablet PC set up with an external GPS and XM weather. Like you said Bruce, it was a nice setup about 7 years ago. Today it's just clunky.

Wow XM weather. Now THAT might make it worth the clunkiness. How did he do that?

I almost pulled the trigger on a refurbed first gen IPad 16gb WIFI for $349. But then I remembered I was waiting for the 3rd generation to come out and see if the screen is anti glare and of course other "upgrades". And then I remembered I'm waiting for the next generation IPhone (my first) and then I would buy a IPad if I want a bigger platform for the cockpit. And then..... It never stops.

I see you're choosing to "rise above" George's insinuations that folks with an affinity for terms like VM ware and COM3 ports should be grouped with folks that may have difficulty getting a date on Friday nights.

After you've been here long enough like I have you learn when to listen to George, when to debate with him, and occasionally, just totally ignore him. George who?

[Flyfshr]

I'll ask him what he used next time I see him.